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Two Completely Different Things = Classic Jamiroquai!
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freeetz!

Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 351
Location: Ukraine

Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 21:12

Orientalfolksong, do you listen to much 70s jazz-funk (Roy Ayers, Donald Byrd, Johnny Hammond, Gil Scott-Heron etc.)? Cause most of the stuff you described as experimental is actually derived from there.

almatri

Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 239

Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 22:46

orientalfolksong wrote:

Quote:

Yeah, When you're gonna learn really was "experimental"

Granted it wasn't a lot. But apart from that, how many other songs from the two first albums lie in several traditional pop (or even funk) standards? I'll grant you that their form is (sometimes) standard, but hey:

Not to mention all the solos and ad-libs from both albums and the lyrics from TROTSC. I continued enjoying much of their material after TWM (which was also experimental in many ways), by the way.

As freetz said, the two first albums are a mix of acid jazz, funk jazz, straight funk with latin influences. Nothing original in it, it was just really really great music. I mean if you listen to this

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2DByyEuYEvc

There a ton of similarities with the band's music right ? This song wouldn't have been an ovni in Jamiroquai's early discography Cool

And let's not forget how they were "influenced" by some well known artists from the 70's
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=caionMVy-Mw

Sounds like Cosmic girl right ?
Early Jamiroquai music was great, but far from experimental. Sure they were a kickass band making timeless music, but they didn't invent anything in the early days.
Jay Kay and the band knew that, that's why they decided to stray away from the acid jazz/jazz funk genre, they wanted to have "their" sound, just as in TWM, and especially in Synkronized.

orientalfolksong

Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 23

Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 23:44

@freeetz @almatri I beg to disagree. As much as I think that only a few songs from these albums could have been released in the 70s with some minor mixing adjustments without seeming like the work of a time-traveller (Music of the Mind, Whatever It Is I Just Can't Stop, perhaps), I don't think any of these two songs could be in EOPE or TROTSC without seeming too vintage. It could be the case, yes, but it would be exception, not rule. In my opinion, Jamiroquai did have a sound of its own on the first three records, which did change untill Dynamite, but was still something they could call their own — even if not homogeneous anymore. Honestly, Mr. Moon has a lot to it that Parliament, Earth Wind & Fire or Kool & the Gang, or, say, Alan Hawkshaw, Alan Tew or the Mizell brothers-produced albums don't. Not that it's better or worse, but to my ears the differences are obvious, and yes, in terms of songwriting — and not simply because the mixing desks changed. They were different because Jamiroquai was — yes, yes — experimenting and thus creating something new. Not out of nowhere, for sure. Contrarywise, very derivative from 1970s funk (not as much EWF as English library music and Herbie Hancock), but all in all new. Whoever can point 1970s records with such results as Just Another Story's or Revolution's should do it, because I have found lots of gems since 1989 (which was when I started paying close attention to music), but none quite like this — again, not in terms of value, but of character. Had Jamiroquai not been an experimental band on those two first records, we could very well have another Brand New Heavies. But, as much as I like some of BNH, we didn't. And I honestly find it most interesting. For instance, I hear Nick Van Gelder's drumming style in the demos and live tracks he posted on YouTube recently and it sounds very close to american funk from the likes of James Brown in style, less tight, more relaxed, which is very different from what we heard on EOPE itself and on. This, along with Toby's choice of synths and chords led Jamiroquai away from this type of funk and closer to Donald Byrd, Bobbi Humphrey, Roy Ayers (as you mentioned) and Herbie Hancock. This is kinda why whenever I hear "true fans" here ranting about how they want the funk back I don't feel it's quite right — what Jamiroquai seems to have given up on this new record is the jazz. But I digress.

orientalfolksong

Joined: 07 Jun 2005
Posts: 23

Posted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 23:49

Also, about TWM: I do think there are other "crossover" or "fusion" songs there that just hadn't been quite tried before, such as Virtual Insanity, Didjital Vibrations or Travelling Without Moving. But there are many pastiches on that album. Cosmic Girl, Everyday, Alright, Drifting Along, Spend a Lifetime, Do You Know Where You're Coming From and You Are My Love are examples of songs that didn't try anything different, as they were trying to recreate disco, usual ballads, funk, drum'n'bass etc. Not that they're bad, of course, but I think that it was when their work began to be more comfortable to listen to, more structured in traditional patterns, and even more solid in terms of song structure. Let's face it, TROTSC was a mess, in the best of possible senses. =)

almatri

Joined: 07 Dec 2006
Posts: 239

Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 07:05

Jamiroquai clearly sounds fresh because of Toby IMO, the guy was not a big funk fan as Jay was, so he was able to stay away from some stereotype of this music. But still, Jamiroquai clearly borrowed from the classics to create their albums. Even on TROTSC, if I remember well Just Another's story's intro is from another song. The truth is, Jay Kay's voice has a LOT to do with Jamiroquai's uniqueness. People criticizes Jay's individualism, but the way he ALWAYS makes the music flows around his voice gives something special to it. I'll be honest, I love Incognito, but I was never touched by a vocal performance in any of Bluey's songs. Roy Ayers's songs are classics, but vocals on sunshine for example are not unforgettable. Yeah TWM was more accessible, but it was still them trying to be more experimental. And they tried to be more experimental again on Synkronized and AFO

freeetz!

Joined: 31 Jan 2003
Posts: 351
Location: Ukraine

Posted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 07:35

To make it clear, I don't agree with anyone who says that all Jamiroquai did back in the day was copy other people's stuff from the 70s. Of course they had enough talent and personality to originate their own musical ideas — unlike lots of "retro" funk bands today, who are simply trying to emulate 70s bands (e.g. The Bamboos, Breakestra etc). It this regard, TRotSC was actually somewhat experimental and psychodelic compared to EoPE. And I'm too yet to hear a tune as badass as Just Another Story. But I guess it depends on what you call experimental. Compared to musicians who actually originated and shaped jazz-funk and fusion music (Herbie, Jaco, Miles etc.), Jamiroquai's music was anything but experimental. In some other thread here I referred to Hey Floyd as an experimental track, because it was very unexpected and sounded like nothing I've heard before, especially with that sudden reggae part. But it's not Frank Zappa, of course. Back to Two Completely Different Things, I believe it's fair to say there's something reminding of old-school Jamiroquai – carefree breeziness of tunes like If I Like It, I Do It and Stillness in Time, great melody, lots of brass, wicked bassline. I'd say it's not Jamiroquai repeating themselves, it's Jamiroquai BEING themselves.

jamfan2005

Joined: 08 Dec 2005
Posts: 332

Posted: Fri Oct 29, 2010 03:41

check out this guy playing bass to the song. Man this guy can play. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lWcaH4MX3mw

bigball123

Joined: 17 May 2009
Posts: 108
Location: Los Angeles, CA

Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 05:47

Judging by the results in the voting post, this is by far the best cut on the album for fans who love old Jamiroquai.

pranavc

Joined: 27 Aug 2010
Posts: 33

Posted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 17:49

this is hands down the best song on "Rock Dust Light Star". I do not have to wait for it to GROW on me. It hit me instantly and I have been playing it on repeat.

jayscam

Joined: 17 Jun 2005
Posts: 70
Location: France

Posted: Mon Nov 01, 2010 16:16

The best i've even heard from Jamiroquai !!!!!!!!!!!!! YOUR THE BEST GUYS !! This tune is for wilds road _________________ Bercy 2011 !! ... What else ?!

Star*child

Joined: 27 Oct 2010
Posts: 14
Location: Antwerp, Belgium

Posted: Mon Nov 01, 2010 16:54

Word people !!!! This is one of my favourites too, I just FEEL the old Jamiroquai in this song... totally loving it! _________________ Music is the only hope we have for Revolution.

LittleS

Joined: 24 Apr 2009
Posts: 34

Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 08:38

Definitely one of the strongest songs in the album. So funky and soulful! I definitely was missing these sounds in out Gaga-dominated everyday. sigh I'm trying to pay closer attention to the lyrics, since it doesn't seem the cheeriest theme when you listen to them, but it's still solidly in my top 3 alongside She's a Fast Persuader and Smoke and Mirrors. _________________ I'm steppin' out, so cut me loose...

jayscam

Joined: 17 Jun 2005
Posts: 70
Location: France

Posted: Thu Nov 04, 2010 10:03

This song remind me ... Love Boat ... Exciting and new of course ! _________________ Bercy 2011 !! ... What else ?!

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