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| Who is your favourite candidate? |
| Hillary Clinton |
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16% |
[ 5 ] |
| Barack Obama |
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70% |
[ 21 ] |
| John McCain |
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6% |
[ 2 ] |
| Ralph Nader |
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6% |
[ 2 ] |
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| Total Votes : 30 |
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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 Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 17:06 |
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The US presidential elections 2008
On CNN, BBC World and other TV stations, the next presidential elections in the US are the predominant topic. I just wondered who you guys would elect, especially our US American Jamily members.
Here my own opinion:
If I were a Democrat I'd vote for Barack Obama to be the Democrats' presidential candidate.
But to be honest, my favourite candidate is Ralph Nader. He truly has new ideas for the USA, especially in enviromental matters, which the US really need! The US consume much more fossile energies than the European Union. Actually, the EU's population exceeds the US' one with more than 100 million inhabitants! Why do the Americans waste so much energy? I don't know.
Ralph Nader stands for efficient engines in cars, an industry that pollutes way less...
Unfortunately he doesn't get as much mediatic attention than the Democratic candidates and John McCain, so I don't think he will get elected.
Well I hope the Americans will vote for the lesser evil, namely the Democrats' candidate!
Hey, with the Democrats the US could have their first female or black head of state. Wouldn't that be cool? 
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deesh
Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 2717
Location: +001
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 17:10 |
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I hate posts like this...they always turn into 'hating the USA' posts, which some is valid, some is not, but I find it funny that it is mainly from those that live outside of the USA, which is fine, but whatever...
but I'll play...On April 22nd, I'm voting for Barack Obama.
I wouldn't say it'd be cool to have a first female president or cool to have a first Black president. No one would care or think it was cool if they didn't do a good job.
It's politics, so 'good' is really up for intepretation... 
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 17:55 |
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| deesh wrote: |
| I hate posts like this...they always turn into 'hating the USA' posts |
Well, I hope and I am even quite sure the usual Jamirotalk users will behave concerning this topic.
And yes, you're right. Having a female or/and black head of state isn't cool, unless he or she is doing a good job.
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Ivy
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 336
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 18:49 |
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Last edited by Ivy on Mon Oct 18, 2010 02:42; edited 2 times in total |
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deesh
Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 2717
Location: +001
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 19:07 |
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I can understand it, but the issue is too many people say things about USAmericans that are broad generalizations or stereotypes because they are being fed media from a mass communications outlet.
I am not at all saying those things aren't valid because I get angry and am angry at my own government, however...for me, personally...it gets annoying. I can't explain it and I'm sure I sound a little funny, but another country can be right alongside the USA in making horrible decisions, etc, but somehow on forums (including this one), the USA is usually the sole target of the insults.
...and USAmericans are as well. When people only see what they want to see....
I'm getting a bit deep, so I'll bow out of this topic unless necessary. I should have never said anything in the first place because it is hard to explain where I'm coming from 
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 20:53 |
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| deesh wrote: |
| I can understand it, but the issue is too many people say things about USAmericans that are broad generalizations or stereotypes because they are being fed media from a mass communications outlet. |
Exact!
Before I went the first time to the US I was quite hostile to the US. But then I met Americans in the USA and I changed my mind. Americans are as normal as any other nation too. Of course there are some cultural differences, as they like baseball more and we football.
Ah, when I'm talking about sports, there is one fact I really like about Americans: I went to see a baseball match in Boston. Of course there were some viewers making much noise to support their team, but they weren't rioting as some of our football viewers. Even if I like more the game of football, it was so cool at Fenway Park, full of people celebrating baseball in peace. We Europeans and Latin Americans could learn a lot from the North Americans in that domain. (I say North Americans, because I went to a baseball game in Montréal's Stade olympique aswell, which was as peaceful as in Fenway Park. Although I have to admit that the atmosphere was better in Boston.)
Another thing I liked in the US (I've been in New York and Boston) is when you have a problem in public, total strangers will help you out immediately. OK, I have to admit that in case of an accident this is the same thing here. But I'm talking about minor problems, like finding one's way on a map. Here you have to ask before someone helps you. There people approach you as soon as they see that you have problems to find your way.
What I don't like is (I'm talking in general, there are exceptions of course like anywhere) the general ignorance of the US Americans. Many Americans asked me where I was coming from. I answered that I was coming from Luxembourg. Whether they replied "Ahhh, Luxembourg in Germany!" or "I don't know where Luxembourg is!". (Not knowing where Luxembourg is no big deal, it's really tiny, so you can oversee it. But saying that Luxembourg is located in Germany hurts my national pride. It's like telling Americans their country is still owned by the British queen.  ) Then I told them that it's a tiny country in Europe between Belgium, Germany and France. Most of them didn't even know where to locate Belgium. It's like not knowing as European that New York is on the East Coast and San Francisco on the West Coast. But college students, people who went to college and dossers (yes, you read right!) knew where to locate Luxembourg. After my journey through North America I had the impression Canadians (French and English speaking) are far more instructed than US Americans.
Nontheless I want to underline the general kindness of Americans. Yet another example we North and Middle Europeans could follow!
Why am I telling you all this? Well I want to show that I appreciate the USA as much as any other country I've been to. There are nice people and assholes everywhere and that there are even things we can learn from the Americans.
It's wrong to judge people only through the media. But I see, you understand it. Our views about the USA are conditionned by Hollywood movies, American series (Just look at things like "Sex and the city" or "Desperate Housewives", total nonsense, but some people really think American women are in general like in those series) and music which nowadays has mostly English lyrics.
| deesh wrote: |
| I can't explain it and I'm sure I sound a little funny, but another country can be right alongside the USA in making horrible decisions, etc, but somehow on forums (including this one), the USA is usually the sole target of the insults. |
True again, just look how Russia is playing with its power having so much natural gas and oil and opressing any serious political opposition.
Or us Europeans, who used to enslave the whole world. In fact the USA occupy nowadays the position countries like England and France used to have.
But people prefer to critic the USA. First of all, because Europe (and I think the rest of America and Japan too) is totally immerged in US American culture, like Hollywood movies, American series and music.
Second, nearly all the white Americans and Latinos are something like us Europeans' cousins. As you know, it's always easier to quarrel with family members than with strangers.
Third, the US government plays world police behaving like being missionaries of democracy, although it supports countries which were recently nearly fascist dictatorships. (Chile, South Korea, South Vietnam...) Other countries are also supporting dictatorships, but opposed to the US, don't behave like being a warrant of democracy in the world. (Like China supporting Cuba...)
Well, Europe used to do the same, so I understand Americans telling us we don't have to give them lessons, because our democratic governments used to behave themselves like pigs in history. (I just say colonies, especially in Africa and Asia.)
I know, I'm writing a lot here. And I still haven't finished.
To get on-topic again, there are two things I wonder about the US electional system.
First of all, they way the president is elected. Why isn't the next president simply proclamated by looking which candidate got the most votes from every American who voted? Or like in France, with a eventual second round, when there isn't anyone having at least 50% of the votes in the first round? The technology of today would allow that, so why aren't the USA changing their electional system?
Second, there are lots of American artists making advertisment to register to vote. (For example Frank Zappa used to do that quite often. And Michael Moore does.) Why aren't the USA (and many other countries) simply introducing the general vote duty, like we have it here in Luxembourg, Belgium or even Australia. Don't tell me it doesn't work for such a big country like the USA if it works for Australia.
Now I've finished this post, I'm looking forward to your reactions!
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Ivy
Joined: 25 Jan 2005
Posts: 336
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 21:06 |
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Last edited by Ivy on Mon Oct 18, 2010 02:41; edited 1 time in total |
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 22:20 |
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| Ivy wrote: |
| other well off countries or with smoother relations .... are more likely to be angered by indirect generalizations via mass media? |
I know some good examples, being targets by the anglo-saxons:
France: They eat frogs and snails, always drinking wine, thinking only about sex and being lazy.
The typical Frenchman carries always a baguette under his arm, wears a basque hat on the head, has a yellow Gitane maïs cigarette in his mouth and wears a tight white shirt with dark-blue horizontal lines. One of his specialities is to be a loser on a military level because he behaves more girlish than a normal British or American man.
Germany: The typical German is a Nazi and very noisy, not speaking but shouting, wearing an imperial pointy helmet and always prepared to invade a weaker country. He acts always with a militar discipline even in all day's life and isn't funny at all, drinks a lot of beer and is a huge antisemite. And German women are tall, fat with blond hair, in fact the most ugly in the world.
Or Germans are drawn like the stereotypical Bavarian. Men in their Bavarian "Lederhosen", women in their Bavarian "Dirndl" celebrating every day "Oktoberfest" drinking a large amount of beer out of huge glasses and eating only sausages with sauerkraut.
I saw such stereotypes in Anglo-Saxon television shows and movies, like in the Simpsons, Blackadder, the Bundys (sorry, I forgot the original name), the Nanny, Monty Python's Flying circus...
Germans are quite angry still being considered as Nazis and Frenchmen being considered as girlish sex-monsters.
Even we Luxembourgers are in the game. I once saw a part of "King of Queens" where they were driving in a very small car, actually a British Austin Mini. They said that it was a car built in Luxembourg, it had to be that tiny because our country is so tiny our roads have to be very narrow.
But be assured, I think this to be funny. It's true, my country is tiny, but there's no real car factory here.
I could go on like this for pages! Americans aren't the only one being caricurated.
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Sandi
Joined: 28 Feb 2008
Posts: 57
Location: Germany
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| Posted: Thu Mar 06, 2008 23:39 |
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When I visited the USA people asked me if Germans use dishwashers. 
A lot of people I met thought of Germany as a very very small country.
They were like "Oh, your from Germany?! Do you know Claudia Schmidt? She's from Germany, too!"
They thought that we all know each other here in Germany. They did'nt realize that Germany has about 80 million inhabitants...
But that's funny!
What I really like about the Americans is that they are really interested in other people's culture.
They ask you so many questions and really want to know what it's like to be German.
I like that!
And now: Back to topic!  |
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JamiroFan2000
Correspondent
Joined: 21 Mar 2002
Posts: 2881
Location: The Jamiroquaized States Of America
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 00:51 |
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 Hello,
 Oh what a fickled topic, but still this election brings us some hope and optimistic candidates, but this time, in Democrat flavoring . I actually voted in the Virginia Primary, where we saw Obama carry more than 60% of the total vote, but it's his speeches and positioning of his campaign as a movement that is more encouraging than more Clinton politiking. If you couldn't tell, I did vote for Obama, simply put, he is encouraging more out of Americans, increasing our young to take the seriousness of voting and government, taking responsibility for bettering America yourself rather than depending on a name-coded leader. When I see Hillary, speaking or trying to encourage voters, all I can see is blank space, that is, trying to brassring the legacy of the Clintons in American politics rather better America during the process. The Republican wing is pretty much dead in the water in my view, McCain, granted a war hero and honorable man, is just too old to be president, and whose views, as "Democratically Sidlely Sugar-coated Views For Conservative Republican Consumption" as they are, is just another Bob Dole, definitely electable but not in the current circumstances in our economy and world. America cannot afford anymore time or money in Iraq, time to bring troops home, punish the Bush Administration under heavy Congressional Oversight, fix our Healthcare to be more reasonably priced and affordable for joe america and work out all the kinks in bipartisan ways. Later....
Sincerely,
JamiroFan2000
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 00:56 |
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| Sandi wrote: |
A lot of people I met thought of Germany as a very very small country.
They were like "Oh, your from Germany?! Do you know Claudia Schmidt? She's from Germany, too!"
They thought that we all know each other here in Germany. |
That's a thing they could do with people of Luxembourg, because there are less than 500000 inhabitants in Luxembourg. But if you meet an American in America as Luxembourger, you are in 999 cases of 1000 the only Luxembourger he knows. (Except once I was in Boston's Italian district. There was an elder man of Italian origin asking: "Hey, you looka lika tourist. Where do ya coma from?" I answered: "From Luxembourg." He again: "Ahhh, I hava family in Luxembourg!"
| Sandi wrote: |
What I really like about the Americans is that they are really interested in other people's culture.
They ask you so many questions and really want to know what it's like to be German.
I like that! |
That's so true. If you are a tourist you always have a lot to tell an American. They're really curious, that's why I wonder they're in general so badly educated concerning foreign countries.
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 01:40 |
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| JamiroFan2000 wrote: |
| I actually voted in the Virginia Primary, where we saw Obama carry more than 60% of the total vote, but it's his speeches and positioning of his campaign as a movement that is more encouraging than more Clinton politiking. If you couldn't tell, I did vote for Obama, |
Good choice Brent. I think Obama is also the favourite candidate outside the USA.
| JamiroFan2000 wrote: |
| When I see Hillary, speaking or trying to encourage voters, all I can see is blank space, |
You had the chance to see her live as I presume. After what I saw on the telly I had the impression that she isn't at ease handling big masses and therefore has less charisma than Barack Obama.
| JamiroFan2000 wrote: |
| America cannot afford anymore time or money in Iraq, time to bring troops home, punish the Bush Administration under heavy Congressional Oversight, fix our Healthcare to be more reasonably priced and affordable for joe america and work out all the kinks in bipartisan ways. |
Yes, you're absolutely right. America needs a proper Healthcare system, just like here in Europe, Canada or even *cough*Cuba*cough*.
But don't forget the environmental level. For example the Big Three have to build much more efficient cars in the US.
They already build efficient cars, but not in the US. GM with its German brand Opel and the small Korean Chevrolets (former Daewoo), Ford with Ford Europe (Gemany and Britain) and Chrysler is, as far as I know, still owned by Daimler-Benz.(OK, Mercedes-Benz isn't a brand of economical nor really ecological cars, but still, a big Benz produces less pollution than a big American car. Actually, Daimler-Benz builds Europe's smallest car, the Smart ForTwo.)
So they already own the right technology for a long time, why haven't they used and aren't using it in their home country?
Maybe Americans have to change their car culture and buy smaller cars with smaller engines. Take me for instance, I bought a car with a 1,5 litre 4 cylinders Diesel engine, that's something you won't find on the American market. American cars have to have 4,0 litre 8 cylinders petrol engines. Why? I don't get it! Just look, you aren't allowed to drive faster than 65 mph or even 55 mph on the freeway. That's way slower than the speed limit on European motorways (for example here in Luxembourg around 80 mph and in Germany there is none, even if I disapprove this), why do you need such big engines then, if we Europeans have cars that have usually much smaller engines?
I have a question about some heaps of junk you see on American roads, the ones I saw when I was in the US and the ones I see at MTV's Pimp my ride:
Isn't there something like a technical control for cars imposed by the State or the Federal government, which takes out too old rusty cars that pollute too much?
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FRA
Jamily Coach & Correspondent
Joined: 07 Aug 2004
Posts: 5477
Location: London don
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 10:41 |
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Obama is the new man, of course.
Lots of people are in ecstasy over the prospect of the junior senator from Illinois being elected President.
There's even a website called "Is Barack Obama the Messiah?"
He says people want a spiritual community: "they need an assurance that somebody out there cares about them, is listening to them—that they are not just destined to travel down that long highway towards nothingness".
I like him very much and i would vote for him if i was an american citizen.
I appreciate his talk of change and the fact that he has not been in Washington long enough to be in hands of anyone!
Italy's gov teaches!!!!!!
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deesh
Joined: 23 Feb 2002
Posts: 2717
Location: +001
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:24 |
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I can't respond to everything right now, because I am about to go to the airport to fly to a CARE (www.care.org) conference  , but I will say this....
Right now, I have two choices of who I could realistically vote for. I laid out the issues that are important to me, which is healthcare, the ending of the war, education, global poverty, AIDS and economic stability which includes jobs for USAmericans. The person that talked the most about these things in the manor favorable to me was Obama. I also want someone who will represent the USA in a respectful manner around the globe.
However, I am not easily convinced of ANY politician. They all talk a good game and play a good game, but then somehow start playing by a new set of rules when they win the game. I am also not easily one to fall into hype, and boy..is there is a lot of hype over Obama.
But there also is a lot of hope and just a glimpse of perhaps change and right now, for me and for many other USAmericans I know...thats all we have to hang on to.
USAmericans don't have it as easy in life as some people outside of this country may think. Katrina is really a good measure of that and a representation of many things many of us face in this country. So, when there is a glimpse of someone turning that around, we grab, we cling and we run with it - what other choice is there? Some of us don't have it bad, but it isn't easy as many would believe. Struggle is struggle.
I spoke to my students the other night and they said the important thing to them is ending the war and affordable education. But, one also said that she doesn't want Obama to win because she is afraid he will get killed like Martin Luther King Jr. (not comparing the two overall, but you know...). I thought that was very interesting and a very real insight.
Have a great weekend all, Deesha
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Last edited by deesh on Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:37; edited 1 time in total |
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ophone
Joined: 31 May 2005
Posts: 2191
Location: Lëtzebuerg
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| Posted: Fri Mar 07, 2008 11:34 |
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| deesh wrote: |
| But, one also said that she doesn't want Obama to win because she is afraid he will get killed like Martin Luther King Jr. (not comparing the two overall, but you know...). I thought that was very interesting and a very real insight. |
That's a point, but I would rather compare Obama with John F. Kennedy. Both are democrats. Both belong to an ethnic minority (Obama is black, Kennedy was an Irish catholic). Both are almost treated like rockstars. Both are very popular outside the US too. Both are quite young presidential candidates.
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